跟贾陆英老师学《论语》为政篇第五章 2013年12月24日 圣诞快乐！

- W1 g4 ^ p8 |' c! _' V, P7 v/ Qmso-ascii-font-family:Tahoma;mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma;mso-bidi-font-family: Tahoma;color:#006EFE;mso-font-kerning:0pt">今日圣诞，老猫先祝大家圣诞快乐，虽然是洋人的节日：）下午贾陆英老师继续在老秘网, b; P8 j/ i2 rmso-font-kerning:0pt">QQ* Y& N, l& u/ }' x7 _& {5 kfont-family:宋体;mso-ascii-font-family:Tahoma;mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma; mso-bidi-font-family:Tahoma;color:#006EFE;mso-font-kerning:0pt">群“重温经典读书会”49231471辅导我们学习《论语》。贾陆英老师一直记挂着我们这群“大学生”，原本这节课是安排在周三下午的，但贾老师届时另有要事，所以今日上午便特地在群里发出预告，提前到今日下午开课。有此良师，夫复何求？闲话少叙，立即把上课实录整理奉上。3 Q% l9 a; ^" O1 ]$ a5 G0 n0 \ mso-font-kerning:0pt">

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$ o5 g3 J2 I; x; @ font-family:宋体;mso-ascii-font-family:Tahoma;mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma; # \" i b0 R" G& ]mso-bidi-font-family:Tahoma;color:#006EFE;mso-font-kerning:0pt">贾陆英：1 @$ { B9 |4 j2 S; D- ^, ] mso-font-kerning:0pt">

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4 \9 s. c5 a: P( i: W) Qfont-family:宋体;mso-ascii-font-family:Tahoma;mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma; * O8 ~' T# ]9 B/ Smso-bidi-font-family:Tahoma;color:black;mso-font-kerning:0pt">今天下午，我们学习讨论《论语》为政篇第+ o9 F! F1 s, x5 v* Smso-font-kerning:0pt">51 c! Y( K( Z6 t: S5 Zfont-family:宋体;mso-ascii-font-family:Tahoma;mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma; mso-bidi-font-family:Tahoma;color:black;mso-font-kerning:0pt">章：9 P1 B+ B% y3 t( _9 M mso-font-kerning:0pt">
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- D" v6 ?& p7 H2•5 0 [2 O" T$ r& ^. N! u$ w2 wTahoma;mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma;mso-bidi-font-family:Tahoma;color:black; mso-font-kerning:0pt">孟懿子问孝，子曰：, z7 U/ C$ o) l4 l9 H mso-font-kerning:0pt">“' i9 C( }' @' v( k+ n: [ R( Z! smso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma;mso-bidi-font-family:Tahoma;color:black; 6 n3 y( l( {: \# x7 P6 \mso-font-kerning:0pt">无违。4 z3 J/ z+ c1 W! A# {2 {. ?mso-font-kerning:0pt">”6 n& Z' |4 Z0 t O4 Z+ f mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma;mso-bidi-font-family:Tahoma;color:black; - `2 y# H: y! U( `, dmso-font-kerning:0pt">樊迟御，子告之曰：+ U; v& D, j( ^' E6 B% J( c& [( E1 a7 tmso-font-kerning:0pt">“& m- u f' B) h! ^3 ]4 `6 O' w( _ mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma;mso-bidi-font-family:Tahoma;color:black; h1 a6 N6 {" r3 E& Smso-font-kerning:0pt">孟孙问孝于我，我对曰无违。) g0 w" c! z! l/ y color:black;mso-font-kerning:0pt">”: o0 C n* C3 Y0 G& y Tahoma;mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma;mso-bidi-font-family:Tahoma;color:black; mso-font-kerning:0pt">樊迟曰：6 L& t- @6 d. u mso-font-kerning:0pt">“. ^1 p4 K1 g' v0 P; h: N) T5 f mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma;mso-bidi-font-family:Tahoma;color:black; $ t" J8 w; D5 n2 o; zmso-font-kerning:0pt">何谓也？# q' C) S( V `. T8 K mso-font-kerning:0pt">”0 e! n5 K% ?9 ^/ B% G) t# @mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma;mso-bidi-font-family:Tahoma;color:black; ], ]' p9 K" s: W# mmso-font-kerning:0pt">子曰：) J5 h+ W" _' s& p- E mso-font-kerning:0pt">“; D$ V; o0 D- A1 m) T% n mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma;mso-bidi-font-family:Tahoma;color:black; mso-font-kerning:0pt">生，事之以礼；死，葬之以礼，祭之以礼。& m. `$ a* ]& {color:black;mso-font-kerning:0pt">”

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1 i" `( a2 s) V) G Tahoma;mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma;mso-bidi-font-family:Tahoma;color:black; mso-font-kerning:0pt">孟懿子：鲁国大夫，三家之一，姓仲孙，名何忌，懿是谥号。他的父亲孟僖子临死时要他向孔子学礼。无违：不要违背礼。樊迟：孔子的学生，名须，字子迟，比孔子小四十六岁。御：驾驶马车。孟孙：指孟懿子。, s v% y% O) f! w7 V Pmso-font-kerning:0pt">

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3 `. [0 F: ^0 p10.5pt;font-family:Tahoma;color:black;mso-font-kerning:0pt">
( a/ c, u/ i, I: z Y7 H) Z- g" G" W5 o3 M* `1 F4 cTahoma;mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma;mso-bidi-font-family:Tahoma;color:black; mso-font-kerning:0pt">孟懿子请教孔子什么是孝，孔子说：6 o2 h3 D( N6 ~% ]9 M 10.5pt;font-family:Tahoma;color:black;mso-font-kerning:0pt">“( W0 A* ~! f6 l4 y |mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma;mso-bidi-font-family:Tahoma;color:black; 3 h4 G8 w+ z7 _) h) o# wmso-font-kerning:0pt">孝就是不要违背礼。4 q) `* C( E6 }4 `4 B 10.5pt;font-family:Tahoma;color:black;mso-font-kerning:0pt">”; D3 @, W, G& y% s. fmso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma;mso-bidi-font-family:Tahoma;color:black; 2 u0 p4 Z: _. kmso-font-kerning:0pt">一天，樊迟给孔子驾车，孔子告诉他说：8 @2 D3 n& \# @$ g0pt">"# p/ ^. L7 c2 U+ s7 e! y mso-ascii-font-family:Tahoma;mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma;mso-bidi-font-family: Tahoma;color:black;mso-font-kerning:0pt">孟孙问我什么是孝，我回答他说不要违背礼。- D" N4 W! k/ |2 S mso-font-kerning:0pt">"# B% }2 ]& d+ r4 g) m3 Z$ m2 O+ m font-family:宋体;mso-ascii-font-family:Tahoma;mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma; mso-bidi-font-family:Tahoma;color:black;mso-font-kerning:0pt">樊迟说：: K; c# D8 X& f7 O$ p5 L. \1 t2 u mso-font-kerning:0pt">"" O* |$ N. }. [# Dfont-family:宋体;mso-ascii-font-family:Tahoma;mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma; mso-bidi-font-family:Tahoma;color:black;mso-font-kerning:0pt">这是什么意思呢$ {% @7 W/ C5 P0 [1 y8 d7 J mso-font-kerning:0pt">?" - `1 I& e1 K- m( T0 I! N- i font-family:宋体;mso-ascii-font-family:Tahoma;mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma; mso-bidi-font-family:Tahoma;color:black;mso-font-kerning:0pt">孔子说：4 f* r! {# q' i K( Amso-font-kerning:0pt">"7 n2 C$ r9 G" [2 [/ j5 H2 c font-family:宋体;mso-ascii-font-family:Tahoma;mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma; 0 t# t3 p. M8 |; Omso-bidi-font-family:Tahoma;color:black;mso-font-kerning:0pt">父母活着的时候，要按礼侍奉他们；父母死了，要按礼来埋葬他们，祭祀他们。% k/ H. S( g, G4 ~4 Kmso-font-kerning:0pt">"

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! S1 O w J' b( \ a$ a' o7 e3 S2 |: x( c! j( T 10.5pt;font-family:宋体;mso-ascii-font-family:Tahoma;mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma; 9 q% g2 T. G/ r& w zmso-bidi-font-family:Tahoma;color:black;mso-font-kerning:0pt">问：怎样理解孝就是: M; T1 k( P$ P, {9 t0 } 10.5pt;font-family:Tahoma;color:black;mso-font-kerning:0pt">“1 o! R# r& z/ [' Q1 e3 pfont-family:宋体;mso-ascii-font-family:Tahoma;mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma; mso-bidi-font-family:Tahoma;color:black;mso-font-kerning:0pt">无违5 W- o. C: J1 G3 @10.5pt;font-family:Tahoma;color:black;mso-font-kerning:0pt">”* y1 h2 Z/ o# k3 @) f' e font-family:宋体;mso-ascii-font-family:Tahoma;mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma; mso-bidi-font-family:Tahoma;color:black;mso-font-kerning:0pt">？* J3 j8 i" Z1 _% u' w6 o* _8 A4 Z 10.5pt;font-family:Tahoma;color:black;mso-font-kerning:0pt">

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) C( Y1 x" T1 P r5 J 10.5pt;font-family:Tahoma;color:black;mso-font-kerning:0pt">
/ c6 s/ B& {! z( J8 H% W0 o( `) O& o' |6 ~' u9 Z9 FTahoma;mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma;mso-bidi-font-family:Tahoma;color:black; mso-font-kerning:0pt">答：孔子教人是很讲针对性的。孟懿子不能遵从他父亲贤而好礼之教，所以孔子针对他讲得; l5 g& ]9 O4 u' smso-font-kerning:0pt">“8 v; F' K0 {4 a/ e+ cfont-family:宋体;mso-ascii-font-family:Tahoma;mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma; mso-bidi-font-family:Tahoma;color:black;mso-font-kerning:0pt">无违6 ~9 E0 B) Z7 @1 p; s) ?4 cmso-font-kerning:0pt">”- \2 ^- y) n* ?) f7 B9 E& _ font-family:宋体;mso-ascii-font-family:Tahoma;mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma; ; K2 k( B5 [! x9 ?; D g' Mmso-bidi-font-family:Tahoma;color:black;mso-font-kerning:0pt">，就是不要违背父亲的教诲，这是就具体情况所做的回答。但是就普遍事理而言，孔子讲% A: V ]! e. \2 Rmso-font-kerning:0pt">“- @1 R4 [! k# k+ p font-family:宋体;mso-ascii-font-family:Tahoma;mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma; # P7 J( |$ d. lmso-bidi-font-family:Tahoma;color:black;mso-font-kerning:0pt">无违$ e! `. w) B2 omso-font-kerning:0pt">”: Z8 s/ Q/ G! z- W1 p! X3 m T( N& w font-family:宋体;mso-ascii-font-family:Tahoma;mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma; mso-bidi-font-family:Tahoma;color:black;mso-font-kerning:0pt">，强调要以礼事亲，不可违背于礼，6 e: I) j$ S3 @9 ^* ^, F( Xmso-font-kerning:0pt">“) n0 p: r( f/ o6 k( N font-family:宋体;mso-ascii-font-family:Tahoma;mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma; mso-bidi-font-family:Tahoma;color:black;mso-font-kerning:0pt">生，事之以礼。死，葬之以礼，祭之以礼。+ W. W9 X- A3 n% \2 J8 ?mso-font-kerning:0pt">”4 L, |; w9 R. V$ K3 Z3 ~. y( C7 x hfont-family:宋体;mso-ascii-font-family:Tahoma;mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma; mso-bidi-font-family:Tahoma;color:black;mso-font-kerning:0pt">父母在世，如有不合乎礼的言行，子女是不应当顺从的，而要以合乎礼的方法劝谏，这是对父母真正的爱护、尊敬。孝的精神，还应当体现在父母去世以后，要按照礼制去安葬他们、祭祀他们，这才算子女尽孝有始有终。# W/ l% T, g: K- v7 v mso-font-kerning:0pt">

% J2 I# o0 j$ g7 O( q$ G) a10.5pt;font-family:Tahoma;color:black;mso-font-kerning:0pt">
) U$ c. r- Y3 _7 X, r$ t4 Z0 q; x; w q# I' k7 m% ~1 C. M 10.5pt;font-family:宋体;mso-ascii-font-family:Tahoma;mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma; mso-bidi-font-family:Tahoma;color:black;mso-font-kerning:0pt">问：为什么说以礼事亲才是孝？" V! X2 B1 j0 L5 X1 H; n' L10.5pt;font-family:Tahoma;color:black;mso-font-kerning:0pt">

% f! [1 Y. ]2 C6 ?0 i/ K/ Q% ^10.5pt;font-family:Tahoma;color:black;mso-font-kerning:0pt">
2 u1 p" i, i+ R1 i, c' P+ Z" K2 ]6 ^1 kTahoma;mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma;mso-bidi-font-family:Tahoma;color:black; . [& h% U+ i8 ~% _. Fmso-font-kerning:0pt">答：本章谈孝的重点是，孝要落实到礼上。孔子讲仁与礼的关系，一方面强调仁是礼的核心，礼应当体现仁的精神；另一方面又强调，礼的规定体现了仁的要求，依礼而行就是仁。据此，是否做到了孝，要以是否依礼而行来衡量。* Y4 \5 ~: i+ V7 Z" g- m mso-font-kerning:0pt">

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4 z/ d* r# {4 u% `5 M 10.5pt;font-family:Tahoma;color:#006EFE;mso-font-kerning:0pt"> 

8 |7 Q: {2 U2 \/ Y- m. w3 V7 V- G @mso-ascii-font-family:Tahoma;mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma;mso-bidi-font-family: Tahoma;color:black;mso-font-kerning:0pt">孝最重要的是心敬，心敬外化出来的表现是礼遇！反过来说，虽然礼遇有加未必出于心敬，但若是不加礼遇那就一定是心不敬，也就是不孝啦。所以外在的礼对于孝来说很重要，如若无礼那必然是不孝！对父母尽孝道，是义( R& |: ?! n* o6 N# n$ Y2 ?/ t1 o mso-font-kerning:0pt">
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+ F, [$ y. q7 F, r3 G+ }2 S9 A mso-ascii-font-family:Tahoma;mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma;mso-bidi-font-family: ' P6 c) \' i2 P' V. Q- S2 fTahoma;color:black;mso-font-kerning:0pt">孝最重要的是心敬，心敬外化出来的表现是礼遇！/ T2 k7 t) n% Y9 [) \ t& p mso-font-kerning:0pt">——, c/ V0 H# p) Vfont-family:宋体;mso-ascii-font-family:Tahoma;mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma; mso-bidi-font-family:Tahoma;color:black;mso-font-kerning:0pt">赞同。孝的本质，是发自内心的对父母的恭敬和感恩之情。有此心，才会有孝行。0 r$ @8 R% C7 ~& @8 lmso-font-kerning:0pt">

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& f8 V& }; s% p2 umso-ascii-font-family:Tahoma;mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma;mso-bidi-font-family: Tahoma;color:black;mso-font-kerning:0pt">贾老，昨天晚生正好读到战国时期儒家关于礼、丧、祭的论述6 J4 D5 t) N- ^/ H2 C' z+ _mso-font-kerning:0pt">22 x% N u" _% `2 _! K6 [" ffont-family:宋体;mso-ascii-font-family:Tahoma;mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma; 6 k* ?/ t( U* h0 Nmso-bidi-font-family:Tahoma;color:black;mso-font-kerning:0pt">对父母的孝道，是义。如何尽孝，是礼。如何行礼，就是生而不违，去世行丧礼，祭祀行祭礼。对父母的孝，绝对不能行功利主义，现在社会上很多人在父母有能力的时候，和颜悦色，等到父母年迈无力，不能给自己帮上什么了，就放弃赡养父母，这是一种巧言令色，有所图谋。这三点做到都是不简单的，先说不违，能够做到遵循父母的教导，按照父母意愿行事之人有几？晚生做不到，起码现在说，不孝有三无后为大，父母成天逼婚，依旧违背了。老吾老以及人之老啊. m" ?* `/ ?/ S) z6 Bmso-font-kerning:0pt">

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孝经

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" Q p6 h1 T9 t# P mso-ascii-font-family:Tahoma;mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma;mso-bidi-font-family: Tahoma;color:black;mso-font-kerning:0pt">孝，如今还在于与父母交心、沟通，体谅父母的难处，分担父母的责任。9 Z; u9 L5 Q9 ?7 O% vmso-font-kerning:0pt">——6 }0 D' P F$ V$ ?* G font-family:宋体;mso-ascii-font-family:Tahoma;mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma; mso-bidi-font-family:Tahoma;color:black;mso-font-kerning:0pt">对，这是从情感上关心父母，是尽孝的重要内容。生，事之以礼。死，葬之以礼，祭之以礼。# H* _+ [2 k* B' J) W# x) }mso-font-kerning:0pt">——9 G, {2 Z+ }1 ?2 M4 G: Hfont-family:宋体;mso-ascii-font-family:Tahoma;mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma; 5 v/ e" f0 N8 G2 t8 q1 {, {mso-bidi-font-family:Tahoma;color:black;mso-font-kerning:0pt">对父母的孝道，是义。如何尽孝，是礼。如何行礼，就是生而不违，去世行丧礼，祭祀行祭礼。《孝经》说：' R" s; v3 z0 u# |7 Omso-font-kerning:0pt">“ _5 A F/ n. ?& kfont-family:宋体;mso-ascii-font-family:Tahoma;mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma; % ~2 d* e: M4 cmso-bidi-font-family:Tahoma;color:black;mso-font-kerning:0pt">礼者，敬而已矣。故敬其父，则子悦；敬其兄，则弟悦；敬其君，则臣悦；敬一人，而千万人悦。所敬者寡，而悦者众，此之谓要道也。) c: W% S! s1 H9 j/ e) V: U0 h7 z mso-font-kerning:0pt">”) \+ M# b( d! ] font-family:宋体;mso-ascii-font-family:Tahoma;mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma; ) i$ u5 x6 u- mmso-bidi-font-family:Tahoma;color:black;mso-font-kerning:0pt">礼的内在依据是孝悌，而外在表现，就是一个4 _& }$ {- s2 L+ a3 Q mso-font-kerning:0pt">“: B3 d# m( I4 B9 i) Hfont-family:宋体;mso-ascii-font-family:Tahoma;mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma; : N7 B0 v: J! q2 h5 Cmso-bidi-font-family:Tahoma;color:black;mso-font-kerning:0pt">敬" }& _4 s' S2 w$ K5 w# @* zmso-font-kerning:0pt">”1 a- m! g% }# g ~: W font-family:宋体;mso-ascii-font-family:Tahoma;mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma; mso-bidi-font-family:Tahoma;color:black;mso-font-kerning:0pt">字。所以，如能尊敬他的父亲，那么其儿子就会喜悦；如能尊敬他的兄长，那么其弟弟就会喜悦；如能尊敬他的国君，那么其臣下就会喜悦。尊敬的是一个人，却能使千万人喜悦。所敬者虽然只是少数，而喜悦的人却有千千万万，这就是为什么把推行孝悌之道和礼乐教化称为! H: R* F2 c8 h% \4 p8 t `- Dmso-font-kerning:0pt">“$ y$ Q; |3 ^: x( q6 e8 Q9 I5 x! `font-family:宋体;mso-ascii-font-family:Tahoma;mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma; . a3 I( v; j+ A( i$ s& F; bmso-bidi-font-family:Tahoma;color:black;mso-font-kerning:0pt">要道( M* X: H- G& }: \ mso-font-kerning:0pt">”5 H$ n5 s$ Y6 \' k8 X! ?font-family:宋体;mso-ascii-font-family:Tahoma;mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma; $ V: ?6 ^! l4 A' h3 Kmso-bidi-font-family:Tahoma;color:black;mso-font-kerning:0pt">的意义所在啊。; k r4 V1 u) h0 d+ \mso-font-kerning:0pt">

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8 `. r+ h5 h3 H; y r3 ~* mmso-ascii-font-family:Tahoma;mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma;mso-bidi-font-family: ( _+ U& j& C- {" G ]# o" ]Tahoma;color:#006EFE;mso-font-kerning:0pt">舍得：& i: l9 c7 H( [: y$ }, W4 p* Q. ^% Y4 t0pt">

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现在用法律手段规定子女要常回家看看，但是由于时间、金钱等各方面的原因，又有多少人是想回而不能回的呢，这个道德层面的问题上升到法律层面到底有什么意义，始终不大明白

贾老师讲得不错，大家发言很踊跃，尤其那个“小风飕飕地”发言很积极，很好！大家要向他学习！{:soso_e128:}

学习、领会、顿悟、提高，贾老师讲的精彩，大家都很出彩。老秘网我们的共同的平台!

贾老师在研究古人和古汉语方面有研究，佩服
# y1 X$ i& r, i

我这里显示也是一堆乱码，怎么回事

好好学习，天天向上{:soso_e195:}

. i- h  C8 `$ O  H贾老师讲的不错，学习了，谢谢

贾老师讲的不错，学习了，谢谢

我这里显示的是一堆乱码！！

不错，学习了，佩服佩服